Scam Report @Noxxen

[soylameraverga]

nevermind im sorry noxor i think hes the scammer the one who wrote all this idk lmao!! it is so confusing ignore my comment thats up sorry guys im outty

[NIeny]

First of all, me selling my gold has nothing to do with this trade since there was far less than 140kk involved in our deal so that's obviously my own gold for sale.

And in response to Nleny;

We started this deal with Dworak as middleman a while back and after like a week or two, Nleny asked to do it without middleman. I was fine with waiting for Dworak, but he insisted on trading accounts without a middleman.

Nleny asked several times to attach an authenticator which I eventually let him do and about an hour after he had the authenticator on my druid I could no longer access the EK (I never checked the MS as everything of value was on the EK anyways)

I never removed anything from the EK (I even asked him to send the gold to the EK as you can see in his skype logs) and when I tried talking with him on Tibia I got zero response so I eventually just recovered my druid.

I don't know what actually happened here, if he thought he could steal my account just because it had an authenticator or if there was someone else that changed password of the EK.. Either way, I did not feel like doing anything further with him so I recovered the druid and cancelled the deal since I had a weird feeling about it from the beginning seeing as he pushed me to do the deal without a middleman plus he had zero reputation and like 2 posts when we started the deal.


@XtrmJosh I don't have the time or will to spend more time on this guy.. It's just going to be word against word so I'll just leave you to decide who you want to believe, none of us can prove anything anyways..

@XtrmJosh as u can see he is nice lier, "(I even asked him to send the gold to the EK as you can see in his skype logs) and when I tried talking with him on Tibia I got zero response so" ye i send 11kk to ek, but he for sure send to chis noobchar ofc(and on ek was 40 kk and full eq)... And also he didnt respond me... i msg to him, trying call. Even later when he logged to ed i recover my ek and i msg to him but 0 contact with him.. 3YyCrvm.png . + PP3L2CX.png.


"First of all, me selling my gold has nothing to do with this trade since there was far less than 140kk involved in our deal so that's obviously my own gold for sale." on ek was 40 kk + full eq so like another 20kk + i send him 11k for tibia coins as u can see on my screens and i bought full eq on his ed so +30 kk.i should scam myself bc of his naked druid and also i put full eq on his ed... -.- he is rly nice lier
Also on ms was some eq and some money, he even took that all.

Also he said 1QMCA14.png so i must pay him so he gave me the key for token right ?...

nevermind im sorry noxor i think hes the scammer the one who wrote all this idk lmao!! it is so confusing ignore my comment thats up sorry guys im outty

LOL i should scam myself ? GG

[NIeny]

@XtrmJosh reminder?

[Josh]

I've been checking the thread daily but still can't conceivably prove that any intentional act of theft has been committed so my hands are pretty much tied. That being said, I would like to make clear that both of you should be more secure in your trading practices in the future. I'll be keeping my eye open for further scam reports as will the rest of the team, but other than that there is little we can do.

[NIeny]

@XtrmJosh u know what? please ban me i scam myself........ and now i sold kk's on secura or tibia coins like noxxen..

[RoxZin xD]

@XtrmJosh u know what? please ban me i scam myself........ and now i sold kk's on secura or tibia coins like noxxen..

Your "proofs" don't show us much, to be honest. You cut a part of the conversation with that last image of you calling and sending many messages to him. What happened in the middle of that? That left me really confused.

Also @Noxxen any pictures of the conversation that can stand your word are welcome. It is not the first time you are involved with a scam report that is inconclusive. Either you're trading with some real stupid people or you're the perfect scammer.

[NIeny]

@RoxZin xD " You cut a part of the conversation with that last image of you calling and sending many messages to him. What happened in the middle of that? That left me really confused." What do u mean ? u mean this ?ZrNNXic.png its next part of number 4 from my first post,and the next one SR17DGy.png and this is yIPC42s.pngnumber 5 from my first post.


@XtrmJosh I understand that you have their hands tied, but once again? What am Im trying to prove?

[Josh]

@RoxZin xD " You cut a part of the conversation with that last image of you calling and sending many messages to him. What happened in the middle of that? That left me really confused." What do u mean ? u mean this ?ZrNNXic.png its next part of number 4 from my first post,and the next one SR17DGy.png and this is yIPC42s.pngnumber 5 from my first post.


@XtrmJosh I understand that you have their hands tied, but once again? What am Im trying to prove?

Not responding to messages and calls for a period of 20 minutes is quite acceptable. People have lives which don't always include a computer. That's not to take anything away from it, if he said he would be online and wasn't I would expect a good explanation, but it looks like he just happened to not be at his PC. Even if it were the case that he was intentionally ignoring you, it would not constitute any bannable offense regardless, while it's unwritten, I don't expect a response from anyone on the forum instantly, I expect to be able to ask one in 24 hours and demand one within 48, but little more than that.

As for the scam itself, it's very difficult to prove. If you'd used a middleman, it would be easy to say that X person sent his part, and Y person didn't, but right now you are calling him a scammer and he is calling you a scammer. There is really no evidence either way, so to make any sort of judgement is impossible. If it were the case that there were some misunderstanding (most likely), this would be far less of a problem. I mean, you say you were logged over, could you have been kicked? Can you be sure of this?

The sad truth is that most cases are like this, and it cannot be proven beyond reasonable doubt that any part of this trade was an intentional scam. I understand the concern, but both of you appear to have a history of trading, albeit somewhat blacked in some cases. That history inclines me towards saying this is an anomaly where someone made a mistake, misinterpreted something, or there was a conflict which someone was too impatient to resolve, and as such to not be able to acquire any evidence which supports any claim.

To put it into simpler terms: Imagine you've just walked into a room with 2 people, they both have black eyes. One says to you "that guy punched me so I punched him back", the other says "no, he punched me so I punched him back". Who threw the first punch? There are no cameras, there are no witnesses, there is only the word of each individual and the probable indication that something did happen.

[NIeny]

Not responding to messages and calls for a period of 20 minutes is quite acceptable. People have lives which don't always include a computer. That's not to take anything away from it, if he said he would be online and wasn't I would expect a good explanation, but it looks like he just happened to not be at his PC. Even if it were the case that he was intentionally ignoring you, it would not constitute any bannable offense regardless, while it's unwritten, I don't expect a response from anyone on the forum instantly, I expect to be able to ask one in 24 hours and demand one within 48, but little more than that.

As for the scam itself, it's very difficult to prove. If you'd used a middleman, it would be easy to say that X person sent his part, and Y person didn't, but right now you are calling him a scammer and he is calling you a scammer. There is really no evidence either way, so to make any sort of judgement is impossible. If it were the case that there were some misunderstanding (most likely), this would be far less of a problem. I mean, you say you were logged over, could you have been kicked? Can you be sure of this?

The sad truth is that most cases are like this, and it cannot be proven beyond reasonable doubt that any part of this trade was an intentional scam. I understand the concern, but both of you appear to have a history of trading, albeit somewhat blacked in some cases. That history inclines me towards saying this is an anomaly where someone made a mistake, misinterpreted something, or there was a conflict which someone was too impatient to resolve, and as such to not be able to acquire any evidence which supports any claim.

To put it into simpler terms: Imagine you've just walked into a room with 2 people, they both have black eyes. One says to you "that guy punched me so I punched him back", the other says "no, he punched me so I punched him back". Who threw the first punch? There are no cameras, there are no witnesses, there is only the word of each individual and the probable indication that something did happen.

"Not responding to messages and calls for a period of 20 minutes is quite acceptable. People have lives which don't always include a computer. That's not to take anything away from it, if he said he would be online and wasn't I would expect a good explanation, but it looks like he just happened to not be at his PC. Even if it were the case that he was intentionally ignoring you, it would not constitute any bannable offense regardless, while it's unwritten, I don't expect a response from anyone on the forum instantly, I expect to be able to ask one in 24 hours and demand one within 48, but little more than that." U rly READ THIS ? At the screens it shows more than 2h. And he did not answer so far... Also if i get back ek why he didnt msg me? And why i spam to him and he dont want a response?

"To put it into simpler terms: Imagine you've just walked into a room with 2 people, they both have black eyes. One says to you "that guy punched me so I punched him back", the other says "no, he punched me so I punched him back". Who threw the first punch? There are no cameras, there are no witnesses, there is only the word of each individual and the probable indication that something did happen" HE EVEN DONT SAY ANYTHING... U WORK LIKE CIPSOFT, PPL SAYING A LOT BUT U MAKE NOTHING. Rly he Show u that much and said that much. Thx i only waste my time for trying proof im scam myself ? GGWP. Through such things just are scams because you have their hands tied .. And bc of that i was scam and i make all this thread just for fun bc i got a lot of time... He Will scam another ppl and u will say "i have tied hands" Cool, so maybe u like him and u help him ? he pay u some cash of didnt ban him ? -.- So Ban me please. I will do not steal something from someone never more!Especially naked accounts!

[Josh]

"Not responding to messages and calls for a period of 20 minutes is quite acceptable. People have lives which don't always include a computer. That's not to take anything away from it, if he said he would be online and wasn't I would expect a good explanation, but it looks like he just happened to not be at his PC. Even if it were the case that he was intentionally ignoring you, it would not constitute any bannable offense regardless, while it's unwritten, I don't expect a response from anyone on the forum instantly, I expect to be able to ask one in 24 hours and demand one within 48, but little more than that." U rly READ THIS ? At the screens it shows more than 2h. And he did not answer so far... Also if i get back ek why he didnt msg me? And why i spam to him and he dont want a response?

"To put it into simpler terms: Imagine you've just walked into a room with 2 people, they both have black eyes. One says to you "that guy punched me so I punched him back", the other says "no, he punched me so I punched him back". Who threw the first punch? There are no cameras, there are no witnesses, there is only the word of each individual and the probable indication that something did happen" HE EVEN DONT SAY ANYTHING... U WORK LIKE CIPSOFT, PPL SAYING A LOT BUT U MAKE NOTHING. Rly he Show u that much and said that much. Thx i only waste my time for trying proof im scam myself ? GGWP. Through such things just are scams because you have their hands tied .. And bc of that i was scam and i make all this thread just for fun bc i got a lot of time... He Will scam another ppl and u will say "i have tied hands" Cool, so maybe u like him and u help him ? he pay u some cash of didnt ban him ? -.- So Ban me please. I will do not steal something from someone never more!Especially naked accounts!

Again, 2 hours is not really an issue, but your screenshots only show 20 minutes worth of you spamming him. Personally, after that level of shit I'd just block your skype permanently. You really think it's appropriate to do that to someone? What if he's at work, in a meeting or something and you're just blowing up his cellphone? What you want him to do? If I buy an account and access to it has been revoked, personally I just reverse whatever I have given and ask questions later. I'd rather know that I at least have access to my character than give someone a chance to take more by rooking the char or something.

What's this if it's not an accusation?:

About an hour after I let him activate the authenticator on the druid the passwords on his accounts were changed so I recovered the druid, simple as that.

Aside from that, what do you expect me to do? Ban him because you tell me he's a scammer? If you want a second opinion I can get another mod to come read through the thread and share their opinion, but so far as I'm concerned I don't know which of you has done what and cannot ascertain that anything has been stolen at all. All I know right now is that a 2 people made a trade and clearly it went wrong. How that happened I cannot prove, and all I have is your word vs his, this is not evidence.

Anyway, you can attack me all you want but the WindBot staff and the mechanisms we use to ensure the community is as safe as possible are as precise and cautious as they can be given the circumstances. All that exists to prove your case is something I'd call hearsay - Google it's translation or just google the word itself and maybe you'll understand that what you say means absolutely nothing, and the fact that you say it repeatedly gives it even less value. The more you try to make the same, pointless case, the less I will consider what you say to be true or even worthy of the disk space used to store it.

Edit: You said:

He Will scam another ppl and u will say "i have tied hands"

As previously and currently, no proof exists to say that he has ever scammed anyone. He clearly has made successful trades, also. By the logic you imply that we should use, I could just try to piss off some enemies or server dominado guild members or something to get back at them by reporting their WindBot accounts as scammer from 3-4 accounts, and they would be banned... Not exactly an ideal scenario to be honest.